Copying vs. Interpretation

luth brodie

Conflicting things have happened lately that have made me question the ethics of the SL community. The entire IP battle has been fought at least since you could exchange you hard earned L$. The problem I have is where the line is?

It seems to me that everyone has their own opinions on the rights and wrongs of source material. I remember quite a while ago when a resident posted proof on the forums that a well known designer was copying designs from a clothing website. Some people were outraged, while others defended it. Now, I understand this is pretty common in SL. A designer finds an outfit they like and they takes bits from it, use as inspiration, draw it by hand, or even just photo source it.

One of the explanations for this is that changing it into working with the SL mesh is enough. Fair use is brought in to play as you can use anything as source as long as you change it enough. But what really is enough? The sidewalk purse vendors change the labels of Louis Vuitton, Prada, Kate Spade, Coach, Burberry, Gucci and Fendi, is that enough? Can a person who copies RL designs still be considered a designer?

There was also a while there when designers were calling other designers out on copying them. Most instances of this seemed to be shrugged off with responses of “probably used the same source photo,” “changed enough,” and even “the copy is higher quality.” Most of the original posters were tar, feathered, and run off. Granted this could very well be the explanation, but we never really do know as it tended to be decided on by who had the most vocal friends.

Then we have the photo sourcing debate. Some say it is ok, others don’t. Then there are those of us in the middle that believes taking bits like I dunno, buttons or something is ok. Again, it seems to be this grey area that no one can agree on.

Next up is downloaded material. Things like textures – not really called upon but happen all the time. 3d clothing sets found on sites like renderocity. And then there are BVH animation files that have saturated SL like a bloody plague. This all seems to be a non issue for some reason. I’ve seen more then enough animators commended while doing this, it really makes me ill. At least for the animation debate (the two posts) seemed to take the side of “if you change it enough.” There is that word again – enough. But no one can give an answer for what constitutes enough. There is also the idea that a lot of them are “for commercial use,” but I’m sure that the intended use was to be within a project and not the file sold almost as is.

So this weekend, Second Style posted this post commending the “fabulous” Paper Couture and their “interpretation” of a gown directly off the runway. Even applauding for how close it matches. This was actually the first time I’d ever seen something like this before and I actually fell out of my chair. Well, not really because of how odd the community is, but it gives you an interesting visual. Now, I have some pretty strong ethics when it comes to copyright – being in the media industry and all – and I know, not everyone shares my views. But I always thought this to be a not really talked about aspect of content creation. How is this changed enough?

Next up we have a report of Last Call being GLintercepted. Yes it’s a verb I made up. Sadly, not as interesting as googled… Whatever, it’s early. I think most of the community is pretty much on par saying that is stealing, unless of course you use it for personal use (debate). Again, my ethics is pretty high up there and say that’s pretty wrong, but the personal use is a bit touchy. I’d never do it, bloody hell I don’t even edit anything I have that has mod rights (unless of course its ugly flares or something) not because of some ethical reason, but because I just can’t be bothered. But we all know I’m some sort of odd ball so it’s ok.

What I don’t understand is how one is right and the other is not.

Now to the more personal issues. No, not those kind. The more people who buy my poses, it seems the more who copy me. Granted its not many, and I’m not going to scream it from my blog pedestal, but it still frustrates me to a point. Even though the annoying shits at libsl say animations can be “stolen” I have yet to see it. What I’m talking about are poses that look a bit too much like mine. In some, minor differences and others not so minor. So, all in all a very grey area but can still get to me. The first time, as you might have read before, really pissed me off. The second and third, I just shrugged it off because the technical ability was extremely lacking. This last one, for some reason, had really bothered me. Maybe I’m just missing my center, my husband who’s away for a poker weekend.

So, from what I gather from the community is the following:

· Copy RL designs

o Get commended

· Copy from SL designers (not GLintercept)

o Can go either way depending on who has more or more “important” friends.

· Copy from SL designers

o Have tps blocked because your “store” is filled with protesters.

· Selling downloaded files

o See no evil, hear no evil. (I’m watching you though)

As LL has taken the stance of not doing much about anything, we the community have to figure out the rules, stick by them, and call people on them. The only problem is none of us seem to agree on anything unless it is skirting the permissions system and stealing from another designer.

See, I’m not trying to take some moral high ground. The problem isn’t that I see stealing as wrong. The part I find wrong, is taking credit for something you didn’t do. If you make poses using someone else’s style and call it your own, you are cheating yourself and your customers. If you are commended for your designing abilities, then you should have designed it, not copied someone else. If you are praised for smooth animations, it should be because you created them not downloaded a motion capture file.

It aint fair… then again fair is a place where pigs get ribbons.


3 Responses to “Copying vs. Interpretation”

  • Dorra Debs Says:

    It seems that if its blogged favorably most comments will be positive, but if its blogged as “they stole my stuff!” or they copied something off the internet then the comments will for the most part be negative. I see nothing wrong with looking on the internet or even at other designers items for inspiration and to learn, but making an exact copy isnt very original imo and a “true” designer makes originals… not copies.

  • Charron Marseille Says:

    Luth,

    After seeing that a small fire has been re-kindled by Tenshi.

    None of this is meant to be personal, but as someone who doesn’t like copying, how would you defend yourself from someone saying that you’ve done the same thing?

    What makes your Rosie the Riveter pose different from the J. Howard Miller version?

    I don’t think that all of your poses are unique, but much like Paper Couture they’re pretty well done. And I don’t see anything wrong with either.

    Thanks,
    -Char

    ( I do wish there was a better place for a discussion like this other than on a few webpage comment areas… )

  • Luth Brodie Says:

    Rosie the Riveter was commissioned by the US government for propaganda during WWII. Generally it is thought to be in the public domain and reprinted and posted in many different venues as a woman of strength icon. This actually is a bit of a grey area because there is no ducumentation on whether it is public domain or copyrighted.

    I have said many times in this blog and anyone who asks that my pose sets start with a recreation of a few pictures then elvoles into 12 different poses. Some of those recreations change more then others. I have also posted many of those pictures as an example.

    Are the stances themselves unique? In SL alone they are unique because I show a wider range of body language then people did when I started. As for being unique in the grand scheme of things, obviously not because there really is a limited amount of ways the body can actually stand. It is very common for me to find MANY photographs of the exact same stance sometimes even after I’ve already made it.

    While you agree or not, in the EU fashion is protected under the EU design right. No I’m not spinning it or just making it up. http://copyrightservice.co.uk/protect/p15_design_rights

    With photography or painting, the overall piece is copyrighted, not the stance. I can paint how Mona Lisa stands, change how she looks, change the background, and change the framing then sell it as my own.

    I used to be a photographer IRL - studio (portrait) then fashion. When you pose the subject yourself, its VERY common to reuse those stances. The photograph itself is copyrighted but anyone can and probably will reuse them. Just look at a fashion mag, just at the stance, and tell me that is not correct.

    Fashion is an end product in both RL and SL, but a pose is a tool of photography. I have never considered myself to be designing at all and have expressed such in many different places. I make poses, and make them rather well with meticulous attention to the SL skin and clothing meshes. These poses are tools for others to use in photography. I have never once (knowingly) recreated a pose made from anyone in SL or from the many sites like renderosity.com where the poses themselves are a product.

    As for your dig about having “it in” for PC over at Shopping Cart Disco: Oddly enough, I don’t actually have one. I don’t buy their clothes because the last time I checked the seams were really bad and that annoys me. I thought this blog post was pretty clear on my own stance on the issue.

    I attempt to insite discussion and on this topic, PC is the only one I have a direct link to use as an example. My doing point/counterpoint in debates is fun, not “railing against.” If I was then I’d comment on every post about them and this issue. I debated the issue on the SS post after the issue was raised, then collected my thoughts and posted on my blog, then debated why PC can do it and others couldn’t at the Herald. That’s not out to get anyone.

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